norvegia sub mod

Max.92
00domenica 11 novembre 2012 14:23
andamento lavori
ciao a tutti.dopo l'uscita della mia sub mod di navarra ho intenzione di fare un altra sub mod che i fan dei norvegesi piacera'.

la sub mod trattera' il periodo delle guerre civili tra le dinastie norvegesi.

gli sverre e le sue casate minori che ancora non so

e gli erikson con ad esempio la casate minori che lo appoggiavano. la casata Bjalbo e i folklung mi sembra che sia scritto cosi'.

l'idea mi e' venuta in mente leggendo il romanza arn l'ultimo cavaliere.

le fazioni le dividero' in
-ostergotland capitanata da sverre che mi sembra la parte occidentale della norvegia
-gotland favorevole agli erikson con le casate citate sopra.
-svealand che sono gli svedesi i quali che per via matrimoniale passarono sotto il controllo degli sverre.credo che storicamente prima del 1176 fosse indipendente.

magari spostero' lo start date a 1176 perche' storicamente iniziarono in questo periodo.al massimo lascero' cosi'


Richiesta:vorrei avere alcune info storiche house o qualcun altro riguardo agli sverre e le sue casate minori che lo appoggiavano e la loro posizione geografica perche' non mi ricordo se gli sverre es dominavano nel ostergotland o nel gotland.vedro' di andare in biblioteca a vedere se e' disponibile il libro di arn.avro' anche l'aiuto del film,sopratutto per gli stemmi

fazioni che scompariranno:
-norvegia che verra sostituita ma non compromette in realta' niente perche' in bc c'e' gia'
-milano.poveri milanesi.sempre loro.
-pisa credo oppure portogallo o georgia.chiedo aiuto anche qui.

i lavori di correzzione degli errori per navarra non finiranno.continueranno di pari passo senza rallentamenti.tanto ora per questa sub mod avro bisogno di info storiche.nello specifico i territori di assegnazione che come gia' detto non mi ricordo benissimo e le casate minori degli sverre.
The Housekeeper
00domenica 11 novembre 2012 15:44

Sembra pane per Mather, enciclopedia vivente su tutto ciò che concerne il mondo scandinavo passato presente e futuro!
Max.92
00domenica 11 novembre 2012 19:47
ok house l'ho avvisato ora.

le fazioni saranno

-sverre norge
-erikkson norge

gli svealand li lascio ribelli.

attendo risposta da mather per info asseganzione territori sia per gli sverre che per gli erikksen e per le casate minori che appoggiavano gli sverre.
+ Mather +
00lunedì 12 novembre 2012 01:39
Ciao Max! L'idea è piuttosto allettante ;D

L'unico mio dubbio è che dalle fazioni che metti in campo sembra che il mod riguardi piu' la guerra civile Svedese

(12esimo secolo tra gli SVERKER

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Sverker

e gli ERICSON (House of Eric)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Eric )

che la cosiddetta guerra civile Norvegese (Birkebeiner e Bagler) .



Se vuoi trattare il periodo ti raccomando caldamente questo link generale :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_war_era_in_Norway

Per il nome da dare alle fazioni suggerisco "Birkebeiner" (o Norge Birkebeiner)

per gli Sverre (è il celeberrimo nome con cui si distinguono in Norvegia, da cui nasce persino una nota gara sciistica) :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birkebeiner

"In 1174, a new faction arose, in rebellion against Magnus Erlingsson. Their leader was the young Øystein Møyla, a son of Øystein Haraldsson. This new faction was called the birkebeiner, meaning birch-legs because some of them were so poor that they wound birch-bark around their legs instead of proper footwear"


"This group had risen in 1174 under the leadership of Øystein Møyla who claimed to be the son of King Øystein Haraldsson. They had received the name Birkebeiners because their poverty led some of them to wind the bark of the birch about their legs, instead of wearing shoes. But in January 1177, the Birkebeiners met a crushing defeat at the Battle of Re (Slaget på Re) and Øystein fell. Sverre met with the remnants in Värmland. After some initial doubts, Sverre let himself be persuaded to become the Birkebeiners’ next leader."

ragion per cui ti converrebbe forse spostare la data a un anno dopo (1177).

Sul link ci sono interessantissime descrizioni sulla tipologia di questi eserciti :

The Birkebein party was formed of some earlier groups with the original goal to depose king Magnus V of Norway (Magnus Erlingsson) and his father Earl Erling Skakke. From a socio-historical perspective, scholars have interpreted the party as the result of the rapid increase in landless markamenn (meaning "border men"), who settled along the Swedish border and made their living by pillaging the rich old settlements. It was this lawless population that became the foremost basis of the birkebeiner, even though it is questionable whether their leaders were paupers wearing shoes made of birch bark.[3]

Sul territorio di appartenenza :

Their leadership came from Trøndelag, (PRATICAMENTE LA REGIONE DI NIDAROS/TRONDHEIM) a region where the social tensions were not as marked, and their motive was rather to stop the transition of power from Trøndelag to Viken and Vestlandet. The powerful Trønder families were simply being left behind by their peers in the south, who had acquired a strong leader in the Vestland earl Erling Skakke in the mid-12th century. In the early 1160s, Erling had taken control of Viken and the bishopric of Nidaros and had subsequently made his underage son Magnus Erlingsson the king of Norway.

"Under Sverre's leadership, the Birkebeiner movement was re-organized and pruned and the most criminal elements were brutally purged from the party. The army consisted more and more of mercenaries from Sweden and England. As early as 1177, Sverre was proclaimed king by his followers, but in reality his power did not extend beyond the borders of Trøndelag and it took two decisive battles in 1179 and 1184 before he could be formally elected king. By then, both the main opponents were dead, i.e., earl Erling (1179) and King Magnus Erlingsson (1184), and the opposition was greatly reduced."



QUI UN PREZIOSO SUGGERIMENTO PER LA FAZIONE DI MAGNUS ERLINGSSON


The party that was behind their rule was not called the Bagli party (Bagler) during their time, but only later. The rival forces against Birkebeins were dubbed by several names, successively Lendsmenn, Heklungs, Kuvlungs, Øyskjeggs and Bagler.


Per la fazione dei Bagler (se decidi di chiamarla così, anche se era un nome non utilizzato all'epoca rimane il piu' diffuso dal punto di vista storiografico) :

Il territorio di provenienza :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viken,_Norway

Viken was the historical name for a district in southeastern Norway, including the area surrounding the Oslofjord and Skagerrak, the strait running between Norway and the southwest coast of Sweden and the Jutland peninsula of Denmark

During the Civil war era in Norway, the Bagler faction frequently established themselves in the Viken area. The wealthier classes, particularly in Viken, were the basis of the Bagler party. The Norwegian kings achieved full authority with developments which reached its peak when the national capital was established at Oslo during the reign of King Haakon V of Norway in 1314.[4]


Interessantissimo anche questo link su Magnus V :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnus_V_of_Norway

The civil war era in Norway would not end with the victory of Sverre over Magnus. After the death of Magnus, Sigurd Magnusson, Inge Magnusson and Erling Magnusson Steinvegg came forth all stating to be sons of Magnus and claiming the Norwegian throne. The civil war era in Norway extended over a 110 year period. It started with the death of King Sigurd I of Norway in 1130 and ended with the death of Duke Skule Baardsson in 1240.

During this period there were several interlocked conflicts of varying scale and intensity. The background for these conflicts were the unclear Norwegian succession laws, social conditions and the struggle between Church and King. There were then two main parties, firstly known by varying names or no names at all, but finally condensed into parties of Bagler and Birkebeiner. The rallying point regularly was a royal son, who was set up as the head figure of the party in question, to oppose the rule of king from the contesting party.



Se decidi per la guerra civile SVEDESE :


Sui Bjelbo (ti consiglio di riferti sempre all'inglese):

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Bjelbo

The house has been known as the "House of Folkung" since the 17th century, and this name is still the most commonly used in Swedish works of reference. This name is probably derived from the oldest known member of the family who is certain to have existed, i.e. Folke who lived about the year 1100, or their legendary forefather Folke Filbyter who lived in pagan times.[2] In an effort to avoid confusion with the Folkunge Party some modern historians have argued that "House of Bjälbo" would be a better name because Birger Jarl lived there and it is the family's oldest known manor. Bjälbo is located in Östergötland, outside of Skänninge in the present-day commune of Mjölby. In any way the members of this dynasty never used a name to refer to themselves since family names were not widely adopted in Sweden until the 16th century, thus there is no "correct name" of the dynasty which would have precedence over the other. [3]


Sui Folkung c'è molta confusione perchè ci si riferisce in diverse cronache o agli stessi Bjelbo o a dissidenti contro gli stessi.

Questo è enormemente esplicativo :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folkung


Later research, though, showed that the political Folkungs were not just descendants of Jarl Folke—instead, they belonged to different Swedish noble families, united by the ambition to fight against a central ruler of Sweden. According to one theory, Folkungs wanted to keep the old "freedom" of the petty kingdoms, including the election of kings, and to retain local power in their own control.[2] Many Folkungs came from the ancient provinces of Svealand, opposing the ruling families of the time that were mostly from Götaland. The first Folkung uprising in 1229 was successful, elevating Canute II on the throne. Later developments were less promising, and the centralized system eventually suppressed their resistance.

PS - Occhio che l'Ostergotland (lo dice la parola stessa OSTER (Est) Gotland (terra dei Goti, La Svezia meridionale) è la parte orientale della Svezia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96sterg%C3%B6tland
Zames
00lunedì 12 novembre 2012 15:17
Progetto molto interessante, ti auguro buona fortuna!
Max.92
00lunedì 12 novembre 2012 18:22
mmm.allora la cosa si complica un po , visto che leregioni in BC in scandinavia non sono molte.

mi piacerebbe fare quella svedese visto che sono piu' ferrato in suddetta materia derivante da libri e film.

potrei fare una mod completa da capo a piedi ma visto che non so fare la mappa userei la mappa di kingdom crusades a meno che qualcuno non me la faccia o io miracolosamente riesca a farla.

dopo modifica messaggio:ho spacchettato teutonic ma il battle mode e' un casino ci impiegherei un casino di tempo a metterlo a posto. i progettisti di medieval 2 non potevano essere un po piu' ordinati [SM=g27964] [SM=g27966]

vedro'..magari solo skara agli eric e la citta' di fianco a vysby agli sverre nell'ostergotlan.vedro'.
cmq in vantaggio resta la guerra civile svedese.
The Housekeeper
00lunedì 12 novembre 2012 19:33
scarica da twcenter il formatter per il battle_models
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